Correct because it doesn’t exist.
“Drake… Where are our names in the Book of Life ?”
Imagine a club where you can rape and pillage your entire life, ask for forgiveness on your dying breath and your in.
As long as you don’t intend to ask for forgiveness in the first place
Right. You have to have genuine remorse. Still dumb though.
I dunno, I guess I think punitive justice is an inherently fucked up concept. When I was a kid, adults used to say two wrongs don’t make a right. At first I thought they were full of shit, but as I grew older, I learned how horrible prisons are and how they don’t make people better.
In Christianity, you have to mean it. People can’t turn their beliefs on a dime like that, meaning it takes work. You have to have done the work. Anyone who’s successfully sacrificing Jesus would basically be capable of giving a meaningful apology to the victims and rehabilitating themself.
Still, heaven isn’t for Me. It’s just not My aesthetic. When I die, I’m going to Ninuan.
well I don’t think that person care about being in or out anyway
Well, nobody can go to heaven because the gates are closed.
When your friend convinced you to go to church and get molested and there is no God
Pikachu
Can’t do that face if you don’t have a face
Unrelated but please never imply “all {ethnic group} is {conventionally bad thing}”, that’s the weapon of the enemy and we don’t use it.
What ethnic group do you think was mentioned…?
The worst was when he said, “All Hispanics are 7:00 AM college courses.” (I actually have no idea)
The monsters i can never stay awake during them. this explains my extended family’s longstanding ethincally and racially based hatred, for which i must give no further explanation
Love how this is getting downvoted. Like there isn’t a rich and storied history of Satanic Panic in the West. Or an active community of Epstein-brained conservatives who are doing blood libel on anyone who fails the Paper Bag Test.
It’s a non sequitur is the problem, and seems to buy into the whole christian prosecution complex that’s a huge problem in the US.
Don’t worry hell is also a nice place. They have Luau’s there
we have the best caterers
When the Christian friend convinces you into religion, but it turns out God hates belief in false gods more than non-belief (you picked the wrong religion).
There is only one guy who guessed correct religion after particularly vivid mushroom trip, but he’s still in hell because he started doing correct things for the wrong motivation.
you picked the wrong religion
There is no way that most people didn’t pick the correct religion. Even if all Christians were “correct” enough to get to heaven regardless of denomination, that still leaves 71%+ of the world who aren’t Christians. And that is best case scenario as Christians are the largest religious group by population in the world currently. And even within the Christian community, there are plenty of in-groups and out-groups that consider one another to be cultish and blasphemy. No matter what you are betting, your chances aren’t great and the majority of the world is still “wrong” and will face whatever consequences come with that fact.
Personally, I’m happy to just not believe rather than to force myself to conform to some oppressive dogma, dump my time and money into a church, and live with shame just to hedge my bets for what would still be bad odds anyway.
I’m not sure I’ll ever get over how arrogant and simple-minded Pascal’s Wager is. The whole premise is either Christianity or nothing; it doesn’t account for any other religion. I just find it hilarious.
I prefer the simple answer proposed by the Death of the Discworld: everyone is getting exactly what they think is coming to them. The final justice is that of your own conscience.
So pick a religion that aligns with your personal values and you’ll be alright.
Don’t worry, Muslims will be overtaking Christians this decade based on current growth statistics
Not like there are any problematic denominations there either, right?
It always impresses me how Christianity = evangelicalism in the mind of most Lemmynauts. Outside evangelicalism (and even partly within evangelicalism), going to hell or heaven as nothing to do with being theologically correct or not. I mean, even the Catholic church, which is both by far the biggest one and absolutely not one of the most open ones states with an absolute clarity that non-Christians can go to heaven too.
I’m old enough to remember when kids started taking their new filp phone to public school and secretly recording their teachers berating their muslim or atheist students. The recordings stopped when teachers realized any student could be recording any conversation.
I’m also coded enough that bigots test the waters with me to see what I’ll agree with. I don’t exactly trust quiet christians. They’re very polite when they assume you’re also religious and things can go quickly downhill if they find out you’re not.
Catholics do not believe that non-Christians go to heaven. Best case scenario, righteous unbelievers go to purgatory. Same with unbaptised babies.
Also, I grew up going to baptist and pentecostal churches. They 1000% do not think my atheist ass is getting into heaven no matter how righteous I am, even though I got baptized for that matter. Unless I repent at the 11th hour and “accept Jesus into my heart as my savior,” anyway. There are certainly plenty denominations that are not all about preaching “hellfire for the unbeliever”, but even plenty of those still believe that is true even if they’re not boasting about it. There are some that allow for people to be saved through ignorance of Jesus (which makes missionary work kind of fucked up when you think about it that way). But even that is not the norm.
Jesus’ sacrifice saving humanity from eternal damnation is a key tenet of nearly all denominations. And most of them also say that you need to actually accept it and turn your life over to him to qualify for the get out of Hell free card.
Source: 37 years of life in the Bible belt as both an active churchgoer and apostate.
Purgatory is a step that leads to heaven, not a final destination. It’s a step that a lot of Catholics will have to take too, according to the catholic church so it’s not something that separates believers and non-believers.
Baptism and Pentecostalism are categories of evangelicalism. So yeah, they believe that. But they’re a minority within Christianity.
Jesus’ sacrifice saving humanity from eternal damnation is a key tenet of nearly all denominations.
Yes.
And most of them also say that you need to actually accept it and turn your life over to him to qualify for the get out of Hell free card.
No. Only in evangelicalism.
Well, consider me brainwashed by evangelicals then. Non-evangelicals really need to step up their PR game.
No. Only in evangelicalism.
False, not only in evangelicalism. The words of Jesus Christ disagree with you. Do you need me to quote the “Narrow Gate” to you? You should be very familiar with it if you’ve read the Bible.
Sure they do! That’s because they’ve become more moderate over the centuries in their long decline since The Great Mortality. This allows them to continue their parasitic ways in a secular society.
However, they spent many more centuries claiming the exact opposite, because the Bible says that most will burn in Hell. Repeatedly. Throughout.
The “absolute clarity” is in direct opposition to what they falsely claim is The Word of God. It’s absolutely clear that they are a cancer on the Earth.
Jesus actually uses two different words which get translated as hell: Sheol, and Hades. This makes sense, because most of the people around where he lived were Jews or Hellenists. Sinful Jews go to Sheol, where their souls are cleansed by a purifying fire and they cease to exist. Sinful Hellenists go to the bottom level of Hades, Tartarus, where they’re punished forever.
Neither of those is what Dante described in his fanfic.
You should see it this way: Look at our world. Look at the bad things. Look at the horrific things. God lets all those things happen AND he wants his dick sucked as if he doing jack shit is a good thing.
Go to hell. Be a rebel. Be proud of it.
You don’t understand, all that suffering and all those dead babies are part of His plaaaaaaan. How can you even have morals without believing in god, please excuse the piles of dead babies.
Dead babies?
“God works in mysterious ways.”
“Trust God’s plan.”
“Everything happens for a reason.”
“You have to have faith.”
“We should pray.”
“He is testing our faith, like the book of Job.”
These are the bullshit answers they give us because they don’t really have an answer.
And when something good happens what do they say?
“God is good!”
“Praise the Lord!”
Look, believe in God all you want but when someone pisses on you, don’t call it rain.
Have a meaningful conversation of how an all powerful, good God can allow so much suffering. Either he isn’t good or he isn’t powerful.
There is a third option - he’s tarded.
True and fair.
Have a meaningful conversation of how an all-powerful, good God can allow so much suffering.
Evolution is driven by adversity. Organisms experience stress, seek to relieve themselves of that stress, and improve upon their function iteratively over billions of years.
Pain is a form of information which gives an organism an imperative to change. And with a great number of organisms, you will necessarily have a great deal of suffering. But without that pain, you lose the incentive to change. The end result is stagnation and decay. A lack of pain isn’t joy, it’s numbness. A lack of adversity does not imply triumph but inertia. What you’re asking for isn’t a Utopia, it’s the heat death of the universe.
I get it. Rape, murder, war, horrific disease, and all the other “adversity” the all-knowing cock known as God allows is for our own good. It’s like a man beating his wife so she’ll know better next time. She’ll evolve due to the information provided by his fist.
“What you’re asking for isn’t a Utopia, it’s the heat death of the universe.” I dunno about you but all I’m looking for is a little less genocide, maybe a bit fewer hungry children, maybe some consequences for well-known pedophiles.
I guess if there is no horrific suffering in the world we won’t evolve. I volunteer you for the next horror, you piece of shit.
ineffable innit?
God has some of the worst fucking representatives. I don’t want to be in a heaven with those assholes
Look at our world. Look at the bad things. Look at the horrific things. God lets all those things happen
Literally the Al Pacino line while he’s trying to convince his son to fuck his sister.
Go to hell. Be a rebel. Be proud of it.
I would simply break the Cycle of Samsara and rejoin the Cosmic Singularity by freeing myself from materialistic desire.
The real problem is God doesn’t believe in me
Yeah, God is kinda an asshole, and if hes not, and hes worried about our opinions of him he really needs to work on his messaging and explaining why stuff has to be so shitty. Being God and all I imagine that isn’t beyond his abilities…
You know, assuming he existed…
Jokes on you, my plan all along was to tempt you away from God to secure a better position in Hell, as is the secret motivation of all atheists. Muahahaha!
It’s like a reward program/pyramid scheme. The more people you recruit , the more they recruit and you end up at the top of your own pyramid of damnation.
Look, is it a pyramid scheme? Sure, maybe. But trying to pick the right religion to get into heaven, and even then there’s no guarantee, that’s like playing the lottery. You’re better off signing up now and getting a better spot in the pyramid.
Sure, blame the atheism and conveniently forget about all the butt stuff.
Poophole loophole
I think if you’re assigned male at birth, you’ve only got the poophole.
Gawds fault then.
Just pull the ole’, “Look! A distraction!” and disappear into the billions-strong crowd stuck in the same boat.
Nah. First thing God does is install little RFID chips into the soul.
Eternity of anything would be boring. You’d eventually become the paragon of apathy, numbed by experience, an akinetic mute.
An eternity of reincarnation where you never remember your past life or know for sure that there is another one. And if you’re thinking that can’t happen because of the heat death of the universe, that’s how they keep it a secret.
Devil’s advocate:
No it wouldn’t if an all powerful deity allows you to not feel that boredom. Maybe you can be bored recreationally. As a treat you know?
Certainly any “infinite reward” existence would be something very different than our current state of being but an all powerful being could create something like it.
Apathy could be removed, or adjusted too. As can memories, let’s say at our own will. Sheep detective style. Let’s replay Elden ring for the first time for the 100th time. Make the conditions perfect to feel the same thrill.
You can exist in bursts. Tailend your life, wipe, repeat. Look back at a whim to see many pasts.
You may be interested in watching The Good Place series if you haven’t
New Atheist: “God isn’t real!”
God: “Oh yeah, real original. Like I haven’t heard that one a zillion times before.” slumps into Angelic throne, full of ennui
Not if your forgetful ;)
Like the dude in Memento.
The old Pascal’s Wager. That’s why I believe in every religion and none at the same time. I have to cover my bases.
The “I’m a Pantheist” approach
Sikh already got this one on lock.
My variant is “any god who requires me to suck his cock to get to the good place is a giant dick, undeserving of praise nor respect. Any god I’d bother to worship wouldn’t care if I did or not”
Pascal’s Roulette Wheel.
this is exactly my little nagging worry…
Don’t worry. There are infinite potential Gods you could be angering no matter which choice you make.
i didnt know a sentance could both be that comforting and that unnerving at once
I’m sure that shit afterward will be just like the shit that came before. You made it through twenty billion years of nothing just fine, you’ll be able to do it again. No bills, no student loans, no hours taking forever, your back doesn’t feel like that when you stand up.
Just become an atheist and anger them all at the same time.
Some of them might like that
You’ll never escape the Cycle of Samsara with that attitude.
why would the region based on a 2000 year old doomsday prophet be real, but the one based on the moon being your mom be wrong? think about it.
What if the moon was your car and Jupiter was your hairbrush?
What if the world was made of glazed donuts?
thank you for blessing me on this day with the sweetest song I’ve ever heard.
No worry, as a very practicing Christian with friends in different traditions, I can say nobody but a few extremists (evangelicals, radical islamists, …) believes that being atheist prevent you to be saved.
Edit: to the downvoters: I mean I know I’m on Lemmy, an atheist echo chamber, but here I’m stating a fact (heaven and hell may exist or not exist, that doesn’t change the fact that most people believing they do don’t think atheists automatically go in hell) to help someone being a guilt-free atheist… you don’t think your automatic response was a little counter-productive here? I’m making a point for your team!
Needing to differentiate yourself from bad Christians is the problem. No matter how tolerant you are, you still make decisions based on magic. Shits insane.
You can’t show a no-God but I can show you spaghetti.
Checkmate.
Okay, bro.
Yup. You’re a “good” Christian alright.
Thank you! I’m so relieved.
Wow, all Islamists are bad, but only evangelicals are bad in christianity? Dude, you be predigest.
No worry, as a very practicing Christian with friends in different traditions, I can say nobody but a few extremists (evangelicals, islamists, …) believes that being atheist prevent you to be saved.
Islamist ≠ Muslim. Here a link which explains the difference.
And colloquially, the difference is even greater, at least in French, my mother tongue. Two of my best friends are a Muslim couple, they are the most regular players of my DnD table. Some times we stop our games for them to pray. They are devout Muslims, but not islamists.
Then why not make the distinction as extremist Muslims since you know most people get it wrong?
I don’t think most people get it wrong. In fact you’re the first one I meet, both IRL and on the Internet, who thinks that Islamist = Muslim. But it may be because English is not my mother tongue, maybe it’s clearer in French than in English. If it’s the case, I’m sorry for my mistake (I added a precision to correct it).
What kind of Christian are you?
Mainline Protestant (in a united Reformed-Lutheran church).
