That’s mostly the first chapter, genesis, the begat this stuff.
R crumb, the comics artist, has a fantastic graphic novel of Genesis where he communicates the emotions through his drawings of what the words are trying to communicate. This made genesis, the most boring and pedantic part of the Bible, more interesting.
The Bible has undoubtedly led to incalculable suffering as a cult, but just as a book, it’s nowhere near the worst piece of literature I’ve ever read.
That’s mostly the first chapter, genesis, the begat this stuff.
But then, don’t discount the chapter where the twelve Jewish tribes send their gifts to Moses (iirc), and the full account of the lavish gifts is given, per each tribe. I’ve read through the whole thing to confirm the madness that the list is identical for each tribe, and is repeated twelve times.
I’d like someone in a US church choose that chapter for their Sunday reading of the Bible, and then see the faces of the congregation sitting through it.
Whoever wrote those books, didn’t have much consideration for the reader.
graphic novel of Genesis where he communicates the emotions through his drawings of what the words are trying to communicate
I have a long-standing dream of someone just adapting the Bible to the screen exactly as it’s written — at least the first parts up to and including Moses’ wanderings. I have a feeling that a direct retelling would cause more than a few butts to be hurt.
Pasolini, an atheist and communist, came close in the approach with ‘The Gospel According to St. Matthew’, but the result is a rather romantic vision of the life of Jesus, perhaps dictated by both the chosen source material and Pasolini’s ‘nostalgia for belief’.
I’d like someone in a US church choose that chapter for their Sunday reading of the Bible, and then see the faces of the congregation sitting through it.
Not in the USA, but I’ve heard some pretty interesting sermons on the topic. Generally about prophecies and how the ancient Israelites viewed certain numbers
Pasolini, an atheist and communist, came close in the approach with ‘The Gospel According to St. Matthew’, but the result is a rather romantic vision of the life of Jesus, perhaps dictated by both the chosen source material and Pasolini’s ‘nostalgia for belief’.
As a former Christian and current socialist, it makes sense for socialists/communists to have a romantic view of the life of Jesus. It’s the one part of my old beliefs that I can’t let go of, since it shaped the values that I have now. The values that Jesus preached are often the same values that lead people to socialism/communism.
Whoever wrote those books, didn’t have much consideration for the reader.
Sizable chunks of the Old Testament were documentation, rather than formatted with the intent of being engaging. It’s like how a family bible often has genealogy hand-written inside it, except it’s the contents of the book itself.
A direct retelling wouldn’t be allowed to air. Murdering your wife in Christ’s name for not cooking you dinner, divinely owning slaves as an entitled Christian, lobster sending you to christian hell; the production wouldn’t get very far.
Love that you’re like “we all know shrimp sends you to christian hell, but wife discipline? Seems farfetched!”
Corinthians, ephesians, most books of the Bible reiterate that women must submit to their husbands:
“Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands.”
And to not submit to their husbands is to go against God.
“But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a wife is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”
And guess what happens if your husband asks you for dinner and you say no?
“So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree desirable to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.”
Eve’s decision to prioritize her own desires over God’s instructions led to disastrous consequence including physical death and eternal obeisance.
“Your desire shall be for your husband, And he shall rule over you.”
“Genesis 2:18-24 “And the lord god said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him”
Christian women are servants to men, and if they defy men, they defy god. Through all of every version of the bible, the Christian punishment for defiance is death.
The begat stuff is Matthew, it’s the genealogy of Jesus. This was important within Judaism and also for the prophecy that Jesus was in the line of David, so He was an eligible Messiah.
When I was around 20 and looking for purpose in life, I actually really tried to get into Christianity.
I mean, they seemed to have a light guiding them through life, something that takes away the feeling of senselessness and chaos in the world. I especially loved the idea that “you can never fall deeper than into god’s hand”.
So I prayed to god to show me the way to him, went to the local church every Sunday, and started reading the bible.
All of it. Cause I obviously wanted to know what I was supposed to believe in. And it completely killed my desire to become a Christian.
The only way to make sense of it, for me, was to interprete the old testament as a collection of the stories that goat herders told each other to make sense of world history, followed by a heavily propagandized history of the Israelite people, legitimizing their claim to Israel after displacing and genociding the people who had lived there before.
The new testament is the story of a wandering preacher who tried to establish an early version of peaceful communism.
But when that became too popular, the Roman state embraced and co-opted the message and turned it into the basis of a hierarchical state church, which later turned into Christianity as we know it today.
Since I read God’s book while praying to God and that was the interpretation I was left with, I have to assume, it’s the one God agrees with ;)
…and promptly disappeared to heaven, but he’ll be back soon, promise! (according to the people who wrote down the story to popularize his teachings and gather followers about 100 years later)
It’s not 100 years later. The first mention of Jesus’ resurrection that we still have was written 20 years latest after the fact. Which is shockingly close compared to other records from that time that are typically written decades if not centuries after.
1 Thessalonians 1:9-10
For they themselves shew of us what manner of entering in we had unto you, and how ye turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God; and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.
For comparison, the earliest written records we have of the 79AD eruption of Mt Vesuvius - something that killed a lot of higher ranking Romans and was possibly witnessed by a quarter of a million people was written by Pliny the Younger in a letter to tacitus at 107AD earliest. Being generous, that’s 25 years after the fact (mathematically speaking though it’s 28)
Honestly it’s probably just a poor translation/carry-down from what would now be understood as “months”. That makes it 72 years which is entirely reasonable.
If you can get hold if it, look out for Thomas Jefferson’s The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth. It’s the New Testament with all the spirituality, supernatural, etc edited out. Instead you’ve just got a book about morals and ethics as taught by some guy.
Ok, you just told on yourself. There is no standard by which Leviticus 20:13 is not really horrible. It was really horrible when it was conceptualized, it was really horrible when King James edited it, it was really horrible when Gutenberg printed it, and it’s really horrible now. I attend a UCC church and my pastors do not defend what the Bible says about homosexuality the way you just did. God is still speaking, I encourage you to listen.
Also, it’s universally accepted that Leviticus 20:13 is not a command for today. It was a law for Israel to show that even earthly means and men cannot keep Israel’s purity. Christ set us free from the law. We don’t need to kill each other for sinning. Because we cannot be pure. So Christ died to make us pure.
I attend a UCC church and my pastors do not defend what the Bible says about homosexuality the way you just did.
UCC has been known to be rapidly spiralling down into heresy. They say vague things like “God is still speaking” and that god for whatever reason always affirms what the white cultures believe is right. Convenient that your god changes his mind just to placate the culture about what white people living in the west think, huh. Once again like Israel of old, man thinks he stands in judgement over God.
for whatever reason always affirms what the white cultures believe is right.
I assume that by this you’re trying to paint homosexuality and the acceptance of it as exclusive to white cultures. This is complete and total bullshit.
There’s plenty of history of non-white cultures that were fully accepting of homosexuality. Japan is a clear example. Samurai wrote so many gay love poems to each other that they had established literary conventions about it.
What happened, around the world, is that colonizers and missionaries went around the world destroying indigenous traditions and customs and instilling bigotry regarding homosexuality. At the same time, suffering under the yoke of colonialism stifled social progress and the potential for the sort of organic social movements that happened in the West.
Even then, we are seeing in the US a rollback of LGBT rights that we only recently managed to achieve. I don’t think it’s fair to generalize “white cultures” as believing LGBT people have rights, just as it’s not fair to generalize non-white cultures as not believing that.
Christianity barely made a dent in Japan. It had extremely limited success in China. Yet same sex marriage isn’t allowed in these places. However, these places can be very materialistic and idolise work over the West. Doesn’t mean that materialism is good over there. There is an objective right and wrong.
And don’t get me started on Africa and Arabia - places wherein homosexuality is outright banned. While they were affected by colonialism more, why is it that it’s the “enlightened” west which did the colonialism is suddenly changing it’s mind on sexuality?
(Also, should go without saying, I am not in support of banning homosexuality or same sex marriage in a secular context - in fact, I firmly oppose doing such a thing.)
Once again, telling on yourself. What’s not horrible about saying people should be put to death for their private consensual bedroom behavior?
That’s not answering my question. You need a definition of “horrible” to understand what isn’t “horrible”.
I’ll give you two suggestions:
Is “horrible” going against what the culture of white people living in the USA and their society says?
Or
Is “horrible” an objective wrong going against what the infallible objective and perfect creator of the universe says?
If you are a Christian then you’d believe the latter. It is also Christian belief that “all scripture is God-breathed” in regards to the old testament. So therefore Leviticus 20:13, in the way as God intended, isn’t horrible. Now some people’s interpretation of this scripture might be horrible - that possibly means you as well. I just see it as part of the law given to Israel to show as part of the wider narrative that humans are incapable of being perfect and that God needed to send a Saviour and prepare the way for Him. Didn’t Jesus command in John 8:1-11 not to stone someone to death, that we do not have the ability to stone someone to death because we aren’t perfect? And what did the only one there who could judge do? The literal Perfect Creator of the Universe - Whom is deserving of all Honour and Glory - was standing before her in Human Form. He forgave her, and what He said was “Go and sin no more.” There is nobody qualified on this earth to carry out Leviticus 20:13. And He who ascended into Heaven and is seated at the Right hand of God the Father is qualified, offers forgiveness.
And this fucking thing is partly responsible for why numerous things are going wrong with humans today and humans of history.
That’s like blaming a doctor’s diagnosis of cancer for someone’s death. The Bible is just a diagnosis of humanity’s problems with a crapton of examples, as well as the solution/hope (although it also makes it clear that people will never try and solve it because of the aforementioned problems)
The treatment plan is “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved”. It’s more like being killed by misunderstanding or misinterpreting the treatment plan. Which can be deadly
In that case it’s more like having a curable form of cancer and eating fruit and studying homeopathy instead, and then dying and having to spin in your grave watching your company make year after year of shit that people still buy for some reason, knowing you put way too much effort into making things high quality while you were alive when you could have clearly just sold rose gold feces and it wouldnt have made a lick of difference to the people following your cult.
The Bible
I skimmed it but all I ever saw was just a bunch of begat this and begat that with some quotations sprinkled in between.
And this fucking thing is partly responsible for why numerous things are going wrong with humans today and humans of history.
That’s mostly the first chapter, genesis, the begat this stuff.
R crumb, the comics artist, has a fantastic graphic novel of Genesis where he communicates the emotions through his drawings of what the words are trying to communicate. This made genesis, the most boring and pedantic part of the Bible, more interesting.
The Bible has undoubtedly led to incalculable suffering as a cult, but just as a book, it’s nowhere near the worst piece of literature I’ve ever read.
It’s definitely not just the first chapter of Genesis. Like the entirety of First Chronicle is genealogy.
But then, don’t discount the chapter where the twelve Jewish tribes send their gifts to Moses (iirc), and the full account of the lavish gifts is given, per each tribe. I’ve read through the whole thing to confirm the madness that the list is identical for each tribe, and is repeated twelve times.
I’d like someone in a US church choose that chapter for their Sunday reading of the Bible, and then see the faces of the congregation sitting through it.
Whoever wrote those books, didn’t have much consideration for the reader.
I have a long-standing dream of someone just adapting the Bible to the screen exactly as it’s written — at least the first parts up to and including Moses’ wanderings. I have a feeling that a direct retelling would cause more than a few butts to be hurt.
Pasolini, an atheist and communist, came close in the approach with ‘The Gospel According to St. Matthew’, but the result is a rather romantic vision of the life of Jesus, perhaps dictated by both the chosen source material and Pasolini’s ‘nostalgia for belief’.
Not in the USA, but I’ve heard some pretty interesting sermons on the topic. Generally about prophecies and how the ancient Israelites viewed certain numbers
As a former Christian and current socialist, it makes sense for socialists/communists to have a romantic view of the life of Jesus. It’s the one part of my old beliefs that I can’t let go of, since it shaped the values that I have now. The values that Jesus preached are often the same values that lead people to socialism/communism.
Sizable chunks of the Old Testament were documentation, rather than formatted with the intent of being engaging. It’s like how a family bible often has genealogy hand-written inside it, except it’s the contents of the book itself.
That’s cool and dandy, but I still think that writing “every tribe brought exact same shit” would work swimmingly.
A direct retelling wouldn’t be allowed to air. Murdering your wife in Christ’s name for not cooking you dinner, divinely owning slaves as an entitled Christian, lobster sending you to christian hell; the production wouldn’t get very far.
What are you on about?
Whats that?
When did someone murder their wife in Christ’s name for not cooking you dinner
Love that you’re like “we all know shrimp sends you to christian hell, but wife discipline? Seems farfetched!”
Corinthians, ephesians, most books of the Bible reiterate that women must submit to their husbands:
“Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife even as Christ is the head of the church, his body, and is himself its Savior. Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands.”
And to not submit to their husbands is to go against God.
“But I want you to understand that the head of every man is Christ, the head of a wife is her husband, and the head of Christ is God.”
And guess what happens if your husband asks you for dinner and you say no?
“So when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree desirable to make one wise, she took of its fruit and ate. She also gave to her husband with her, and he ate.”
Eve’s decision to prioritize her own desires over God’s instructions led to disastrous consequence including physical death and eternal obeisance.
“Your desire shall be for your husband, And he shall rule over you.”
“Genesis 2:18-24 “And the lord god said, “It is not good that man should be alone; I will make him a helper comparable to him”
Christian women are servants to men, and if they defy men, they defy god. Through all of every version of the bible, the Christian punishment for defiance is death.
Why?
“For the wages of sin is death”.
Before I address your insane cherry-picking, where did you get the whole “murder your wife in the name of christ for not cooking dinner” from.
The begat stuff is Matthew, it’s the genealogy of Jesus. This was important within Judaism and also for the prophecy that Jesus was in the line of David, so He was an eligible Messiah.
When I was around 20 and looking for purpose in life, I actually really tried to get into Christianity.
I mean, they seemed to have a light guiding them through life, something that takes away the feeling of senselessness and chaos in the world. I especially loved the idea that “you can never fall deeper than into god’s hand”.
So I prayed to god to show me the way to him, went to the local church every Sunday, and started reading the bible.
All of it. Cause I obviously wanted to know what I was supposed to believe in. And it completely killed my desire to become a Christian.
The only way to make sense of it, for me, was to interprete the old testament as a collection of the stories that goat herders told each other to make sense of world history, followed by a heavily propagandized history of the Israelite people, legitimizing their claim to Israel after displacing and genociding the people who had lived there before.
The new testament is the story of a wandering preacher who tried to establish an early version of peaceful communism.
But when that became too popular, the Roman state embraced and co-opted the message and turned it into the basis of a hierarchical state church, which later turned into Christianity as we know it today.
Since I read God’s book while praying to God and that was the interpretation I was left with, I have to assume, it’s the one God agrees with ;)
It sounds like you missed the part where He rose from the dead…
…and promptly disappeared to heaven, but he’ll be back soon, promise! (according to the people who wrote down the story to popularize his teachings and gather followers about 100 years later)
It’s not 100 years later. The first mention of Jesus’ resurrection that we still have was written 20 years latest after the fact. Which is shockingly close compared to other records from that time that are typically written decades if not centuries after.
1 Thessalonians 1:9-10
For comparison, the earliest written records we have of the 79AD eruption of Mt Vesuvius - something that killed a lot of higher ranking Romans and was possibly witnessed by a quarter of a million people was written by Pliny the Younger in a letter to tacitus at 107AD earliest. Being generous, that’s 25 years after the fact (mathematically speaking though it’s 28)
what’s wild to me is the people who swear by it as the answer to all lifes questions and yet…they’ve never read it.
if i thought and all knowing all powerful being put answers to all lifes questions into a book i’d be reading the shit out of it
HE LIVED FOR 942
DAYSYEARS AND THEN HE DIED.Edit how incredibly stupid I am saying “days”.
Honestly it’s probably just a poor translation/carry-down from what would now be understood as “months”. That makes it 72 years which is entirely reasonable.
Good video
942 days is nothing though… 2 and a half years?
Cancer
If you can get hold if it, look out for Thomas Jefferson’s The Life and Morals of Jesus of Nazareth. It’s the New Testament with all the spirituality, supernatural, etc edited out. Instead you’ve just got a book about morals and ethics as taught by some guy.
I assume he also edited out the slavery bits 🙄
"but Jesus never actually talked about slaves
Yeah, and that’s a major fucking problem
No no no no. It’s the gays that are responsible. THE GAYS!!!
That’s not even what it says. The Bible doesn’t really mention homosexuality too much.
But what it says about it is really horrible.
By what standard?
Ok, you just told on yourself. There is no standard by which Leviticus 20:13 is not really horrible. It was really horrible when it was conceptualized, it was really horrible when King James edited it, it was really horrible when Gutenberg printed it, and it’s really horrible now. I attend a UCC church and my pastors do not defend what the Bible says about homosexuality the way you just did. God is still speaking, I encourage you to listen.
How do you define “really horrible”?
Also, it’s universally accepted that Leviticus 20:13 is not a command for today. It was a law for Israel to show that even earthly means and men cannot keep Israel’s purity. Christ set us free from the law. We don’t need to kill each other for sinning. Because we cannot be pure. So Christ died to make us pure.
UCC has been known to be rapidly spiralling down into heresy. They say vague things like “God is still speaking” and that god for whatever reason always affirms what the white cultures believe is right. Convenient that your god changes his mind just to placate the culture about what white people living in the west think, huh. Once again like Israel of old, man thinks he stands in judgement over God.
I assume that by this you’re trying to paint homosexuality and the acceptance of it as exclusive to white cultures. This is complete and total bullshit.
There’s plenty of history of non-white cultures that were fully accepting of homosexuality. Japan is a clear example. Samurai wrote so many gay love poems to each other that they had established literary conventions about it.
What happened, around the world, is that colonizers and missionaries went around the world destroying indigenous traditions and customs and instilling bigotry regarding homosexuality. At the same time, suffering under the yoke of colonialism stifled social progress and the potential for the sort of organic social movements that happened in the West.
Even then, we are seeing in the US a rollback of LGBT rights that we only recently managed to achieve. I don’t think it’s fair to generalize “white cultures” as believing LGBT people have rights, just as it’s not fair to generalize non-white cultures as not believing that.
Christianity barely made a dent in Japan. It had extremely limited success in China. Yet same sex marriage isn’t allowed in these places. However, these places can be very materialistic and idolise work over the West. Doesn’t mean that materialism is good over there. There is an objective right and wrong.
And don’t get me started on Africa and Arabia - places wherein homosexuality is outright banned. While they were affected by colonialism more, why is it that it’s the “enlightened” west which did the colonialism is suddenly changing it’s mind on sexuality?
(Also, should go without saying, I am not in support of banning homosexuality or same sex marriage in a secular context - in fact, I firmly oppose doing such a thing.)
Once again, telling on yourself. What’s not horrible about saying people should be put to death for their private consensual bedroom behavior?
Oh give me a break. “No true Christian” much?
That’s not answering my question. You need a definition of “horrible” to understand what isn’t “horrible”.
I’ll give you two suggestions:
Is “horrible” going against what the culture of white people living in the USA and their society says?
Or
Is “horrible” an objective wrong going against what the infallible objective and perfect creator of the universe says?
If you are a Christian then you’d believe the latter. It is also Christian belief that “all scripture is God-breathed” in regards to the old testament. So therefore Leviticus 20:13, in the way as God intended, isn’t horrible. Now some people’s interpretation of this scripture might be horrible - that possibly means you as well. I just see it as part of the law given to Israel to show as part of the wider narrative that humans are incapable of being perfect and that God needed to send a Saviour and prepare the way for Him. Didn’t Jesus command in John 8:1-11 not to stone someone to death, that we do not have the ability to stone someone to death because we aren’t perfect? And what did the only one there who could judge do? The literal Perfect Creator of the Universe - Whom is deserving of all Honour and Glory - was standing before her in Human Form. He forgave her, and what He said was “Go and sin no more.” There is nobody qualified on this earth to carry out Leviticus 20:13. And He who ascended into Heaven and is seated at the Right hand of God the Father is qualified, offers forgiveness.
That’s like blaming a doctor’s diagnosis of cancer for someone’s death. The Bible is just a diagnosis of humanity’s problems with a crapton of examples, as well as the solution/hope (although it also makes it clear that people will never try and solve it because of the aforementioned problems)
Except the Bible is less a diagnosis and more a treatment plan. And people definitely have been killed by bad treatment plans before.
The treatment plan is “Believe in the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved”. It’s more like being killed by misunderstanding or misinterpreting the treatment plan. Which can be deadly
In that case it’s more like having a curable form of cancer and eating fruit and studying homeopathy instead, and then dying and having to spin in your grave watching your company make year after year of shit that people still buy for some reason, knowing you put way too much effort into making things high quality while you were alive when you could have clearly just sold rose gold feces and it wouldnt have made a lick of difference to the people following your cult.
Okay then. What’s the cure?
This was a joke about Steve jobs