Edit: My own solution: when it happens, get off the computer and pet the dog.
So let’s say I make a point on a post. I put forward my argument and I support it with evidence.
Now let’s say the first comment is from someone who disagrees with me, but seems to fundamentally misunderstand what I am saying, probably because they read the title of the post and immediately posted the first thing that came to mind.
But my fear, acquired from Reddit, is that people are going to read this guy’s totally inaccurate presentation of my argument and then every comment in the rest of the discussion will proceed as if that’s what I said.
And since, as we all know, fear leads to hate, my first instinct is just to berate this person for being a stupid moron.
This is a bad strategy. Not only is probably against Lemmy rules, it automatically makes me the bad guy.
So: question: how do I handle this person without tediously restating my position again, which is extremely irritating because I already wrote it once and they didn’t read it the first time. What I want is to say something that quickly quarantines the misreading comment in people’s minds so the misreading doesn’t infect the entire thread.
How to handle it: don’t
Let other people in the comments downvote and correct them.
This is what I do
I would try to clarify what I meant by re-wording it.
And so began yet another opportunity for people to declare they’re smarter or more neurodivergent (i.e. better) than everybody else.
My dad is more neurodivergent than yours!! /s
So you think you’re always right, is that it?!?! You’re saying everyone else is always wrong and you could never be wrong?!?!?!?! You think we’re all a bunch of idiots who can’t understand any of your big-brained ideas, because you’re the only person smart enough to understand them?!??!?!?!?!??!?! So you think it’s a waste of time to even try to explain your point?!??!?!??!?!!?!?!???!??!??!?!!?
Is that what you’re trying to say?!1?1(1?11(1?1?1?1?1??1?1???1?!!111??
spoiler
/jk
Autists deal with this daily, on lemmy and everywhere life.
Phase 1: explain
Phase 2: just let it go
And estimate in advance if you have the energy and motivation to get into it. Mostly I don’t even get into it although I would really be happy for constructive exchange.
What is the connection to autism? Why don’t people understand you?
I often switch contexts in my head without informing my partner and assuming they’ll know what I’m talking about.
Your answer kinda proves the point to me, meaning no disrespect.
The issue is we all are using the same words but neurotypical people rely heavily on reading and messaging between the lines, which we don’t do. This results in the so called double empathy problem where there’s a lot of issues in the communication.
Since 99% are usually neurotypical and 1% are autists, the norm is basically NT and we’re the ones who have to deal with this on a daily basis. And since the knowledge of autism is actually way outdated for many people who do not actively concern themselves with this (and even most professionals, sadly), often people think of the really disabled autists and not fully capable people that have a biologically different brain causing this.
This pushes the issue to a wholly different level on highly functioning autists, aka nothing seems different but the struggles are absolutely real and the misunderstandings are on completely different levels e.g. a valid harmless query from the Autist to assess a situation is interpreted as a vile attack on a NT.
Psychologically and socially it’s actually a highly interesting topic.
Can you explain what i said and what point it proved? i have at least two options.
You’ve lost me. And while I provided fundamentals with source I do not comprehend what this short statement is meaning nor trying to achieve but personal ‘winning’ on the internet.
As previously stated we have to manage our social resources tightly and this is where I exit.
You said, “your answer kind of proves the point to me.” I was asking what it was that I said and what point it proved.
I was worried maybe such a brief question would be interpreted as hostile, but you had assured me the atypical people, of which you claimed to be, don’t think that way, that it is is merely an annoying trait of NTs.
I’m starting to think that maybe you are over-interpreting autism into this context. Not that double-bind communication doesn’t exist (thank you for sharing that, btw), but on-line we do away with much of the bother of non-verbal communication (as well as the ability to easily skip over boring conversations and the ability to obliquely reference shit knowing SOMEONE is going to get it), so there is much more parity between NT and atypical people.
I say this as someone with over 1k/comments Lemmy a month after having been here two months, and after having done all my “socializing” on line all my life–but it usually amounts to just this, having a series of one-off conversations with strangers, and it’s the best I can do, socially.
Hey, thanks for continuing. I have to say, you’re possibly right with overthinking. That’s what we do. And hence, we often jump around to the point of getting lost in our own line of thinking - the latter being exactly what happened.
I am now trying to read through the fragments and have a very hard time following myself. If we were sitting together it might be easier, doing this asynchronous is hard work. So thanks for putting up with that and your effort.
Let me do some jumping around mobile and desktop and see of I can follow up.
Follow up edit:
OK I found where we disconnected. So I answered your op question basically and included autism and thought of that as self contained answer as if it was clear.
So it’s kind of meta and apologies for that, it is convoluted. Having deep(er) knowledge of something one tends to miss out explanation of these things, which adds to the issue.
So the connection to autism with misunderstandings lies in autism itself, this literally are the social difficulties which are documented in medical papers.
Now, what might throw you off is the expected ‘that happens to everyone’…and while that is true it’s one of the discussions we have regularly. It’s just on a totally different level.
Its complicated. But it is there, and I didn’t want to hijack your topic or cause bother.
And while this explanation might likely be ‘eh’ for you, don’t worry, hopefully you’ll never have to worry much about it in your life and that’s perfectly fine.
No worries. I discovered the autism lemmy and think I have broad phenotype autism, so I’m always interested in learning more.
I worked at a tech place and got along with everyone there. I thought it meant I was likable and it just different places are going to have different vibes, but someone pointed out tech people tend towards autism, so maybe all that was happening was that I find myself with a group of people who naturally shared my communication style… and that, basically still, I’m unlikable.
You made a weird connection to autism that was unrelated to the post. You were asked to clarify the connection, and gave the example that “neurotypicals” rely on “unclear” communication. It’s unclear how that’s relevant. You did not provide evidence or clarification, and now you’re being an asshole.
Thanks (honestly) for clearing that up.
See - that’s the issue. There is this inherent obvious connection on the op topic that you can’t see. And that’s fine, you’re NT. However I am not, hence you’re saying I am an asshole for not elaborating a point you can not understand. It’s literally beyond NT understanding.
As is many understanding of yours to ND. And when trying to go into this, I, or rather, we are the assholes. So of course we resign. There is this gap in understanding that I even linked and it’s still not enough.
So, there you go. I am sure it will not or never be enough. It’s just that on the opposite side you as a standin for NT are behaving like assholes, but both sides are literally incapable of getting some points across.
As said, still thanks for your answer. Be kind to people, you might not understand them. (unrelated to me)
Edit oh by the way: weird is the perfect notice of autism by NT. Just FYI
Block and move on. It’s not worth the effort. The points don’t matter and the rules are all made up anyway.
This has been a problem since the early days of usenet.
I suspect there is no good solution
Move on with your life who gives a fuck
BUT SOMEONE IS WRONG ON THE INTERNET!!!
:)
I didn’t even see you reply because I pre-blocked you
;-) (kidding of course)
Whether sarcastic or just meant straight up, I accept :D
Youre missing the point
obtuse means round not pointy silly
well thats an interesting angle to take
It’s acute philosophy
I’m trying to triangulate the next pun, but my attention deficit hypotenuse disorder is interfering.
Not giving a fuck is an acquired skill for some
I’ll spend time clarifying a point for person who
- seems to be asking/arguing in good faith
- seems to be capable of understanding an answer
When it’s not immediately obvious what kind of commenter is asking I glance at their posting history and annotate the account with a note/tag so I remember.
At any point that I’m about to make a post online and I realize that the emotional energy required to continue engaging is more than I’m willing to commit to this particular discussion, I just bail. No reply, no downvote, just peace out. It’s really not worth it.
I do repeat myself. I will do it for awhile and usually this goes into a. Well we have fundamental differences of opinions and we are not going to go anywhere with it. You see much of our conversations and arguments have some fundamental things that the arguer has as postulates. Often times someone can not accept an argument because at its core is a postulate that they do not agree with.
Make one clarifying point comment and then move on.
An example of how to do it:
You: EVs are better for the environment
Comment: Why are you saying that China should rule the world?
You: I’m saying that EV’s are better for the environment no matter who makes them. Last comment.
An example on how not to do it:
You: EVs are better for the environment
Comment: Why are you saying that China should rule the world?
You: I never said that you asshole. Why are you sticking up for China, you fucking tankie. You’re a troll piece of shit, etc., etc.,
Comment: You said China is amazing, you obviously want to go down on them
You: Why are you saying this shit? Etc., etc., etc. blah, blah, blah
I can see the scars, friend. Thank you for your service.
Lol, I should have prefaced with Reddit survivor.
Honestly, I have PTSD from that site. Things are better here, but sometimes my flashbacks get triggered.
It took awhile to get rid of that for me too. I can spot the trolls pretty easily here though, there are about 10 accounts maybe? I sometimes fall for the trap, but it’s getting rarer and rarer. I have found their patterns, but sometimes it takes me a few comments to see that it’s bad faith.
I think Lemmy/Piefed is so much less addicting, that it doesn’t really matter as much. I guess because the anger is the part that’s addicting and I never realized I was in it until I got away. It’s really strange though, I just quit cold turkey. Which is great, but strange. I’m so glad I did.
When you use “troll”, are you implying intent? I think some people are just poor readers, and having decided they are right, now blindly argue for their position regardless of any information.
I’m absolutely implying intent. There are trolls here, for sure. I probably see it more because I mod a larger community and I’m in politics a lot. If you avoid those communities, you probably have a different perspective. People misunderstand too, and if I get it wrong I apologize.
Step 1. Remember the points don’t matter
Step 2. Remember it doesn’t matter if these people agree with you.
Step 3: Why should we even care if they mistook what we were saying
Step 4. If they agree feel ever so warm inside and justified in thinking what you thought… (Ignore all previous steps)
My rule to live by: never engage with comments online. I’ll post a comment, but >99% of the time there is no reason to reply. I’ve said what I wanted. There’s hardly anything to gain from trying to change anyone else’s mind or elaborating further. Someone has to make it abundantly clear that they are responding in good faith to warrant a response. My life has been much better since I started doing this and I would strongly recommend everyone try it out.
Lemmy is becoming self aware
